FabFilter User Forum
Your ideal polyphonic synth?!
Have to answer your question quickly before the masses find out about this and flood you with a million answers ;)
As I've often pondered about what would be the ideal synth for my own use, I have a pretty detailed image about it in my head, so here we go:
2 or 3 oscillators, with a wide selection of waveforms and possibly other oscillator types besides the usual analog waveforms, something like single cycle samples, wavetables, feedback oscillators... if we stick to 'just' analog oscillators, emulations of a variety of makers' oscillators would be ideal, that way the synth could easily have an interesting and useful variety in its basic sound. (I'm a Commodore 64 fanatic myself and its soundchip SID has some interesting waveform combinations and features I've always liked, but to save you from a boring read, I won't go further into details about this =)
Oscillators modulating each other in as many ways as possible. Hard sync, cross modulation, amplitude modulation (ring modulation), frequency modulation, perhaps exploring some possibilities of a more exotic nature like frequency shifting and phase modulation... the more the merrier :)
Two filters with selectable routing, multimode, with as many filter modes and slopes as possible... if it can do emulations of classic filters, it would be nice indeed but I'm more into filters that have a character of its own instead of just trying to sound like let's say a Moog. Nice examples of filters I find good and interesting would be the aforementioned SID chip in Commodore 64 (has a number of nice filter modes, the filter itself is kind of weak due to having a bad implementation of resonance, but I still love it) and the famous hardware synth OSCar (which has been modeled rather nicely in software but let's not go into advertising other manufacturer's products :)
At least three envelopes - for pitch, filter and amplitude, but hopefully with routing possibilities that allow you to choose different modulation sources. And more complex envelopes than just plain ADSRs or with an added stage or two. There exists quite a few ways of doing envelopes and I'm really disappointed that software makers have so far ignored everything else than simple ADSRs when hardware makers have had more complex envelopes in their instruments for over a decade... and something really important, the possibility to modulate different stages of the envelopes with things like velocity or LFOs or other envelopes. I'd love to see a soft synth finally with the capability to modulate Attack with something like velocity, Decay by an LFO and Release by another LFO, instead of just having velocity affect the overall amount of the envelope :D
As many LFOs as possible - I have to lower myself into mentioning another software manufacturer as an example... OhmForce has done about the best implementation of this so far, about all the important modulatable things have their own dedicated LFOs and I find it really sensible, not to mention useful. So I'd suggest a dedicated LFO for every important parameter plus a 2-3 LFOs with selectable destinations, including parameters of the other LFOs. Syncing to different signals like tempo, naturally.
I'd prefer a synth without a mod matrix. Having both dedicated and freely routable LFOs (or function generators if you take a look at Kurzweil's way of doing things) is far more intuitive in my opinion than doing things via a mod matrix - especially if you have dedicated LFOs for the important things already.
Minimal effects. Something like a nicely done modulation effect block for chorus/flanging/phasing and another block for distortion/overdrive and a separate delay. No overkill effect sections with a million different effects because separate plugins will most likely offer better choices when it comes to reverbs and such, but instead a few effects done with the same quality you have showcased with your oscillator and filter.
And finally, a good user interface. One that doesn't require you to surf through subpages and menus, one where the flow of the signal is clearly indicated by the layout with no hidden routing options and other illogicalities that leave you scratching your head when turning the cutoff knob of the filter doesn't change the sound because a small routing switch somewhere makes the sound bypass the filter or even worse, routes the signal to "filter b" that doesn't have its dedicated controls but only a small "a/b" switch that chooses which filter you're controlling :D
Knobs with selectable behavior, preferably with coarse movement in up/down direction and fine movement in left/right direction - but most importantly, selectable by the user. Parameter indicators that show numbers and allow the user to type in numbers. Mousewheel support. Right mouse button support... things that should be obvious in 2004 but still so many manufacturers ignore these...
For me, a good synth is about choices. As many oscillator types and waveforms as possible, as many filter types as possible, etc. Not overkill with 6 oscillators and a mod matrix that looks like a telephone switchboard, and a effects section that has more effects in it that Tangerine Dream in their synth warehouses but with mediocre quality... just a handful of effects that are really an integrated part of the sound.
You see, I have A Vision about this :D (and I've spent many an evening pondering about these issues) And I hope that some day somebody will make it - a soft synth that works as a piece of software instead of a facsimile of a hardware device, utilizing features that software can have, and has sound quality to die for. I'd be more than happy to be of assistance in anything related to this, from doing concepts and drafts to interface design, sound design, beta testing etc. You've really done an amazing job with so far by introducing us you magnificient filter and oscillator and I for one would love to see you come up with an incredible software synthesizer that shows the competition how things can be bettered :)
Sorry for the text flood, I'm just excited about what you'll do :)
Hi just tried the Fab , it sound goood ,well done!
I'll probably buy it in a few days
about a poly synth (and mono also)
--->1 2 multimodes filters whith a separation freq factor (like yam A3k)
--->2 3 or retrigable syncable LFO +mod matrix
--->3 unisson
--->4 3 fast enveloppes with enventually a time factor on decay
--->5 sample support
Finally I would be very Happy with a dual filter whith
envelloppe and LFOs made by You (an Fx processor to put
it simply)
bests
Laurent V
Thanks a lot for sharing your ideas and Visions ;-) It will definitely help us make our next plug something really special. Keep the ideas coming!
Cheers!
Hi...I have mentioned this in my other thread so sorry if I have created some overlap....I would love to see a modular\semi mod approach(you can also swap out\add mods but keep to the existing semi mod synth design)...that way you could design simple or more complex modules(and sell them seperately)and everyone can make their synth as simple or as complex as they want it to be...off course being software,preset configurations and patching would be a basic option(with randomisation for configs,patching and knob settings etc for even more fun)or you can go for the full monty with the creative manual approach...the choice is yours.You guys have definately got the chops and the ears to make your own distinctive\or based on existing established sounding Oscs and filters etc and make this a reality.
How about a secret pet DSP Project....I believe it is from some of your countrymen....maybe they are even living nearby for all you know?....The Synton Fenix...maybe you can borrow one from them to study?..he!he!...then again I believe only 75 were ever made...but I'm sure they will have kept one for themselves.I saw one recently...asking price...a mere ?3000!!!
Here's my addition to the pool of ideas:
- Sound Quality, do NOT compromise. Allow atleast 1 high quality setting for rendering purposes.
- Velocity sensitivity for everything possible and even unthinkable. Lots of soft synths are just too 'sterile' when playing them live as you can't really controll the timbre with touch.
- Pay careful attention to the SLOPE of the envelopes! Preferrably a continuosly variable slope and even modulatable parameter. This is where most character of a classic analogue synth comes! The 'shape' of the envelope. Atleast make it selectable logarithmic, linear, and exponential.
- If you go for the multimode filter approach with 2 separate filter blocks then please make sure to keep the whole synth stereo. That is, make it possible to make wide stereo pads and sweepable pan of each oscillator/noise source.
- I like mod matrixes as it's a simple and clear way of routing things (sorry jmh! ;-p ) and keeps things tidy on the screen.
- NOISE in the circuit! Please, NOBODY has yet truly modelled noise in the circuits of an analogue synth. Most companies have proudly said ".. but without the noise" in their marketing things.. blah! This is why most VSTi's and even hardware VA's sound 'clinical and lifeless'. They are simply too pure. There is ALWAYS a basic noise floor in analogue design and this is GOOD, not BAD. A friend on irc put it quite well: "Developers of software synths need to stop thinking how it must sound and instead sit down and listen, to how it REALLY sounds.."
Simply adding white noise is not enough though, it has to react within the synth arcitecture, like on some old analogues you get slight hints of noise bursts at fast filter envelope settings, barely audible but it adds to the feeling. Of course all this would be best if it's an user selectable setting.
Sorry about that blurt. FabFilter One does sound very good tho :-).
Cheers!
bManic
We have already realized many of these things in FabFilter One. When you listen to our oscillator carefully, you'll notice that there's always a little background noise to liven up the sound (try the triangle wave form with high peak values for a good example). We've carefully tuned the attack/release curves of the envelope generator. And of course, we'll never compromise on quality. :-)
Thank you all for your suggestions!
A lot of people are asking us to create a polyphonic synth plugin. Well, we will. We thought it might be interesting to ask you all what your ideal synth plugin would look like. What features should it definitely have? Tell us!
Cheers!